Have you ever wondered how a blogger's musings can morph into the pages of a novel? Join us on The Bookshop Podcast as we sit down with Jessie Rosen, who's done just that. From the East Coast to Los Angeles, Jessie shares her journey through blogging, scriptwriting, and now, novel writing. Her story is a testament to the power of perseverance and the magic that happens when creativity meets a supportive community. Whether you're an aspiring writer or an enthusiastic reader, you'll find Jessie's candid reflections on the hurdles and triumphs of the craft genuinely inspirational.
Jessie's latest novel, The Heirloom, reveals how her Italian and Portuguese heritage breathes life into her storytelling. Explore the enigmatic allure of Florence and the poignant ways in which our past can weave itself into our life choices.
The Bookshop Podcast
Jessie Rosen
The Sicilian Inheritance, Jo Piazza
Expiration Dates, Rebecca Serle
Burnout: The Secret to Unlocking the Stress Cycle, Amelia Nagoski and Emily Nagoski
Donate to The Bookshop Podcast
Have you ever wondered how a blogger's musings can morph into the pages of a novel? Join us on The Bookshop Podcast as we sit down with Jessie Rosen, who's done just that. From the East Coast to Los Angeles, Jessie shares her journey through blogging, scriptwriting, and now, novel writing. Her story is a testament to the power of perseverance and the magic that happens when creativity meets a supportive community. Whether you're an aspiring writer or an enthusiastic reader, you'll find Jessie's candid reflections on the hurdles and triumphs of the craft genuinely inspirational.
Jessie's latest novel, The Heirloom, reveals how her Italian and Portuguese heritage breathes life into her storytelling. Explore the enigmatic allure of Florence and the poignant ways in which our past can weave itself into our life choices.
The Bookshop Podcast
Jessie Rosen
The Sicilian Inheritance, Jo Piazza
Expiration Dates, Rebecca Serle
Burnout: The Secret to Unlocking the Stress Cycle, Amelia Nagoski and Emily Nagoski
Donate to The Bookshop Podcast
Hi, my name is Mandy Jackson-Beverly and I'm a bibliophile. Welcome to the Bookshop Podcast. Each week, I present interviews with authors, independent bookshop owners and booksellers from around the globe, and publishing professionals. We believe in exceptional writing stories that educate, ruminate, elevate and celebrate a hub where book lovers discover their next favorite read and connect with a vibrant literary community. Established in 2020, my podcast endeavors to uplift indie bookshops and authors, providing listeners with intimate glimpses into their lives and literary styles. By steering clear of interruptions from advertisers, I strive to maintain an uninterrupted flow of conversation that resonates with both guests and audiences alike, amidst the vast array of podcasts available. I'm deeply Thank you. Interviews and finally uploading the finished product to platforms worldwide. Each episode requires days of collective work and expertise. I stand firm in my support for creativity that defies conformity, and I invite you to join me in doing the same. If you appreciate what we do and would like to contribute to the continuation of our efforts, please consider visiting thebookshoppodcastcom and clicking on support the show. Your support means the world. Okay, now let's get on with the show.
Speaker 1:Jessie Rosen got her start with the award-winning blog 20 Nothings and has sold original television projects to ABC, cbs, warner Brothers and Netflix. Her live storytelling show Sunday Night Sex Talks was featured on the Bachelorette. Jessie lives in Eagle Rock, los Angeles, with her husband and their perfect dog, louie. Jessie's new novel is titled the Heirloom. Here's a short synopsis. Shea Anderson's beloved Nona had endless rules for a happy, healthy life Avoid owls, never put a hat on a bed and never, ever accept a marriage proposal that comes with an heirloom ring. Happily ever after is hard enough without bad karma in the mix. Hi, jessie, and welcome to the show. It's great to have you here.
Speaker 2:Hello and thank you so much. I'm so honored, I'm excited and, as I've said already, I'm a big fan.
Speaker 1:Oh, thank you, jessie. I appreciate that and I need to tell you that I really enjoyed your book. It's charming and it took me to Italy. What more could I ask?
Speaker 2:for. Thank you, that was exactly the intention right. Something that you can just take with you, relax into. I keep calling it a balm, so I'm happy it was that for you you relax into.
Speaker 1:I keep calling it a balm, so I'm happy it was that for you. Yeah, maybe something like a lavender with a little bit of patchouli balm. Okay, now let's begin with learning about you your blog, 20 Nothings, writing for television and film, and your segue into writing fiction books.
Speaker 2:It's so funny because, as I've been thinking about the opportunity to talk about this journey with you, my blog actually started as emails. I was out of college, I had written a college column for my newspaper and I was so hungry to be writing for somewhere, anywhere. Of course, no one would offer me a byline. I had no real experience. So I started sending these emails to a small group of friends about my 20 nothings, as it came to be called experience and unbeknownst to me. They were passing these emails to friends of friends, of friends of friends. Until someone finally said you really should be putting these emails into a blog.
Speaker 2:And, as has happened a few times in my career, I needed a bit of a nudge. A blog. I just didn't. It didn't seem like the thing. This was only in 2005. So the blog began and with it, really my whole writing career launched.
Speaker 2:And not only did I love writing first person, but once again, a nudge came from a friend who was reading the blog, which was full of dialogue, because that was what I was experiencing, being this 20 something in the city. And she said there's so much dialogue, have you ever thought about writing plays or scripts or screenplays? And so, once again, I was kind of nudged in this direction and I had always had a passion for that work. But when you grow up on the East Coast and didn't have family members in that industry, I couldn't imagine how I would take that step. So about a year of reading books on screenplays and taking online courses, I then finally staged my own play and then started writing scripts and then told my mother I was moving from the East Coast to Los Angeles. Oh boy, how did that go down? It's better now. I've been here for 13 years.
Speaker 1:Oh, my goodness, that's a big leap for both you and your mom.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was huge, it was a huge leap and I moved with a full-time job in marketing. I had maintained work in PR and marketing and, true, nine to fives for many, many years and when I got to Los Angeles, just did what you do wrote bad scripts and then wrote slightly better scripts and then had a manager who left the industry, then had a second manager who left the industry and, just you know, found, really frankly, slowly found my way to ultimately writing for television, developing my own shows, which was such a thrilling process and that was really the kind of stepping stone to writing fiction, which that had been my little girl dream. I just you know the bigness of it. It didn't, it never had to felt possible. So, yeah, that's about a almost 20 year. So many different writing disciplines along the way, story.
Speaker 1:My husband and I both worked in the film industry me as a costume designer and he as a key grip and I learned so much about not just the film industry but it a costume designer and he as a key grip and I learned so much about not just the film industry but it taught me life lessons, respect for everyone who knows their job, helping each other. When you're on a really fast, you know the sun's going down, magic, hell's happening and everybody just has to drop everything and help one another. And you don't realize at the time but you're seeping in all the elements of film and for me it was writing and continuity, and entrances and exits, film sets of fascinating places. Were you able to get onto the sets? I did, yeah, yeah. So you've experienced the calm and the chaos, the expectations of every single person on that set. When you first experience it, it is overwhelming. Oh, it's a tiny city.
Speaker 2:You come and you all move in and you build a tiny city and then you run it for as long as it takes to get the production done and then you disassemble the city. I love it and I, you know, I really hope that this path of writing novels potentially leads back to or reincorporates the path of writing screenplays and being on set with them.
Speaker 1:So, fingers crossed, we shall see, well, you have a lot of contacts in that side of the industry now, so that helps it is.
Speaker 2:And I also think it's huge training ground when you're writing television and film story structure and churning story. And then the second thing is taking notes, being prepared to take those notes and hear those notes and incorporate them. You know those are the lessons that were hard to learn, but I have really felt that being so beneficial in this format switch for me.
Speaker 1:Let's talk about your latest novel, the Heirloom. Is this your first adult?
Speaker 2:novel. It's my first adult novel. So about six or seven years ago I published a young adult kind of a twisty thriller which was more aligned with what I was doing in television at the time. It was published with a really small digital imprint, so it was a great moment for me and it was what convinced me I wanted to come back to novels, but this is kind of the moment you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you seem excited about this book. Yeah, yeah, exactly. The Heirloom is based around the superstition of being given a vintage ring as an engagement ring. How deep is your superstition regarding this idea? So deep, I wrote a whole novel about it deep. I wrote a whole novel about it. That was a great answer, Jessie.
Speaker 2:Yes, this idea came to me in the months before I got engaged. And, as a fun and, I think, kind of sweet fact, this book comes out the week of my 10 year wedding anniversary.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's really sweet year wedding anniversary.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's really sweet. So 11 years ago I said to my husband, based on the superstition from my grandmother that was really throughout the entire family, I don't care what the ring looks like, it just cannot be vintage, it cannot be an heirloom, and for me that even meant a grandmother's grandmother's grandmother. I mean, if I had known the woman or spoken to her, known about the marriage, much like what happens in my novel. But yeah, the superstition was very deep for me and when that started to happen in my life, I realized the debates I was having with women that I knew, with even men that I knew, and I thought this is fertile ground. Everybody has an opinion about this. So I tucked that idea away for a really long time and I thought I would write it as a screenplay, to be totally honest. And I just I was at a time where I so wanted to dive into something longer form and to really just be able to like stretch out in the story. So that's why I wrote it as a novel.
Speaker 2:What is your heritage? This is Italian, so this is my. I figured it was yeah, yeah, well, and such is such as is Italian, so this is my. Yeah, I figured it was yeah, yeah, well, and such is the story. So I think there are many cultures and it's been really interesting to learn about the different superstitions of different cultures as I prep to write the book and then now, especially as it's preparing to come out. But I think the Italians may be the winners in terms of all the superstitions and how important they are and how adhered to they are, generation after generation.
Speaker 1:And during the story, your main character, shay, travels to Italy and Portugal. Apart from the delights both countries offer, such as glorious food, history and general cultural beauty, were there other reasons you chose these two locations?
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I think there's two reasons for both places. One is my own family heritage. I wanted to tie the story to that depth of something that was passed down and down and down and since Shay's family, like my family, has that Italian heritage, I wanted her to get to go there and be in that space. But the other real reason is I wrote this during the pandemic and I was the first draft is I wrote this during the pandemic and I was the first draft, I should say and I was longing for two very specific places Italy, which is just the place where my heart lives, it's where I was able to live in college, and just a place that was very, very special to me.
Speaker 2:And Portugal was the last place I really traveled to before the world shut down. So I had these two places in my mind and I was so desperate to go there physically. And since I couldn't physically, those just became the choices for where I wanted. I personally wanted to spend time. Their beauty, their dynamic, I think the romance of them was also a really nice fit. But there were some selfish reasons in there too.
Speaker 1:When you said you were there for college, was that in Florence or Rome?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I lived in Florence and I was able to speak the language, and yeah, it's a magical place, and I also think it's a place that lends itself. Florence and Rome, they lend themselves to this kind of momentum where you can kind of stretch out and be slow and be romantic, but then go, go, go. And I wanted that because the time that my character spends there does have a portion of mystery solving and speed, and so those felt like a good fit for that, those cities.
Speaker 1:Well, like you, florence is definitely one of my heart and soul places. I love the stories that are everywhere in Italy. Even in the food, I find there's layers of history within the flavors. Actually, I better stop talking about Italian food or I'll start salivating. Italy is an incredible country. The people, the food it's fantastic. I feel the same way, but, as I said, it's more than the food. It's everywhere you look, everything you touch. There is a deep history and I guess that's the same worldwide. But for some of us, certain areas really resonate and Italy is definitely one of the main places where I feel this. I feel that connection.
Speaker 2:Don't you feel like those places too? They like wake you up in a way yes, absolutely they wake up the romance in you. They wake up the passion. All your senses are on fire, and so I think they're especially conducive to falling into decisions that may feel a little outside yourself. They just lend themselves to magic, because when you're there, you feel like you're in another world and you feel like another person in that world. So that always happens to me. I have to be very careful when I'm in Italy especially.
Speaker 1:It's easy to get carried away or perhaps lost in the memories that are there. Yeah, yeah, exactly On page 255, and I have the paperback Shea tells Graham quote you met a specific version of me, end quote. I found that we often become specific versions of ourselves when we meet different people, whether we're conscious of it or not. Was the flirtation and initial attraction what caused Shea to behave differently around Graham, or did the allure of romance of Italy and Portugal caress these feelings, or was it both?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love this question so much and I will say this was a space. I spent a lot of time in the edit because I wanted to try to explain something we often see in novels, where there's a romantic storyline which is a character goes through this very surprising change of affection. She's with one storyline which is a character goes through this very surprising change of affection. She's with one person, suddenly she falls in love with another. Why does that happen? And I think for Shay it's two things. I think it's a little bit of what we were talking about, about the allure of the location and how it turns you into this romantic screen version of yourself, this actress version.
Speaker 2:But I think the second thing is specifically for Graham. Without giving anything away, he is a character with a background very similar to hers and sometimes I feel like and I've had this experience we meet people that awaken us to these ideas about ourselves and then we think, oh, that unlocks something, that's who I am. And if that's who I am and that's who you are, then this must be the answer. And a little bit of that goes on as her kind of yes, she's physically attracted to him, but then she becomes, I think, really attracted to what he could represent for her, how their pasts really align. And is that the safest choice? My character is so oriented toward trying to make the right choice, keep herself safe, avoid heartbreak. So when she meets Graham and he has this different lens on light, I think it kind of opens a door for her and she says is this how I should be? And then I think she falls for that as much as she starts to fall for him.
Speaker 1:I love what you said about what you see in someone else is actually awakening something within you. It's similar to when you get those tickles on your arms. You know and you think, oh, what's happening here. And I feel that that's our subconscious saying you're on the right track, this is where you're meant to be right now and I kind of understand why that feeling of infatuation with another human. It's so strong that we can get lost in that feeling. When I read that piece in the book, I was reminded of something Jung said about dreams Everyone in your dream is a reflection of you. Yeah, beautiful, I wanted to write that phrase. You met a specific version of me on a sticky note and put it on the wall above my desk to remind myself that it's okay to be changing constantly, because we are evolving. We are different versions of ourselves.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, and therefore, I think, becoming that different version of yourself. We sometimes criticize women for, oh, she's dating him and now she's just like him, and I should say that, for any combination of genders or orientations, right, you become the person you become in love with, but maybe that's just a path to you becoming a deeper version of yourself. So I know she's my character and so I have to. I can't, I have to protect her, but I do think that Shay needed that departure from self. She needed to take that path in order to understand really what home base is for her.
Speaker 1:Now that we've delved into Shay's psychological demeanor, I'd love to know about her physical locations. In the book you write about locations around Los Angeles and nearby areas, for example Emma Wood State Beach, which happens to be just down the road from where I live. Did you choose these locations randomly, or are they places you like to visit? Did you choose these locations randomly, or are they places you like to visit?
Speaker 2:They're all places I love to visit. This book. I was so fortunate to have the time Again. It was the pandemic. So when I was rewriting that scene, which used to take place in an interior location, I just thought, like no, this scene needs to breathe. I thought where should it be? What would be important to these sisters? And that's something that happens in the location. And, yes, that is a place I love. It's near a sweet little oyster shack type place called the Lonely Oyster, which I'm sure you know. So I just I took a drive. I got in my car, I took a drive. It was about all we could do around that time was go to an outdoor place and enjoy it. So this book especially has a lot of that. Even the New York locations contain places that are important to me, I think, because I needed that at the time and I also think it just helps the way I write. It helps my process.
Speaker 1:Oh, I love what you said about the space needed to breathe. You needed to bring her from inside to outside. There are many books where the location, the geography, has actually become a character in a book and I personally love this. And for new writers, I think it's another thing to write on a sticky note and put on your desk. Your characters need space and if you feel like this, place them outside, walk them outside. Go for a walk, go for an adventure and see what happens.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, and how it changes the way that they can move and what they see, and then how what they see can kind of impact them. That's really a credit to my film and television training. You know a show or a movie that exists inside a room. There's nothing to look at, it's such a bore. So you're always really pressed to show where you're going to be and what it looks like.
Speaker 1:Let's talk about your writing. So when you're writing a screenplay, you're working on around, say, an hour and a half or two hours plus worth of material compared to a novel which requires around 80,000 words. How did you find this transition Horrible? I found it horrible. Oh, jessie, I love your honesty.
Speaker 2:I couldn't believe it, and I would. I should say the first draft was this joyful. I took my time. I was really spending time with creativity during the pandemic when we weren't working, mostly in film and television. It was the rewrite, it was the draft, one to draft. To rewrite that I just thought every page full of words, because in film and television you know the structure. It runs down the center of the page, it's all dialogue.
Speaker 2:I still cannot believe the volume and really the other thing about it was learning to contain the story in my head and find ways to know it as I was working through it. So again, film and television, to contain 27 pages or to contain, you know, even a hundred pages of a screenplay is one thing, and you build to that. But to contain 80,000 words or 306 pages or whatever it is, it was really. It is still overwhelming. And I should say I'm very fortunately in the middle of my book to rewrite, which will be an exciting thing coming in the future. And again, the volume is what I'm learning to. How do I stay organized around it? Again, the volume is what I'm learning to. How do I stay organized around it, note carding and gridding and just managing a story across that much volume of content.
Speaker 1:I've spoken with quite a few journalists and they say the same thing, because maybe in an article they're writing might be 2,500, 5,000, 10,000, 15,000 words, but when they start to write a book it's like, oh my God, it's hard work.
Speaker 2:I know, even when I sit down now I have to kind of do this little mind trip where I say I'm not writing a book, I'm just today, I'm writing an essay. I'm not writing a book, I'm just writing a chapter, and it helps me to parse it out. Sometimes I think you need to be expansive and think about the whole piece, and then sometimes I think that can be overwhelming. So to just sit down and say the task of the day is just this scene.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I agree completely. Now, because you work in different writing mediums, do you only work on one project at a time, or are you able to work on multiple?
Speaker 2:projects For so much of my career. It was multiple things at one time and I was always supporting myself while screenwriting or while television writing, with little journalism assignments or with branded content work, and that was a way that I stayed afloat. So I was always having to divide my time and organize it and switch medium and even switching from film to television or from a television pitch, a concept, to television staff writing is a different switch of the brain and I have to tell you, when I sold this book, the first thing that was this like weight off my shoulders was I'll be able to focus on one thing for a period of time. I think that's while things may come up in my life that are a good reason to be writing multiple things at the same time. I was really yearning for the chance to settle in and focus and know that at this juncture I had the resources to just really get this right. So it was a huge, huge moment in a long journey.
Speaker 1:Well, I can imagine it's a relief. Yeah, it's a relief. Can you walk us through your publishing story, from your first finished manuscript to finding an agent and a publisher?
Speaker 2:So I've been very lucky while my representatives, which are managers at a management company representing literary individuals, they have always really supported me, not only in film and television but across different platforms. So it was my manager, rachel Miller, who had said originally those seven years ago. I know you're thinking about this as a TV pitch, but maybe it should be a novel. I really think you could push yourself in that area. And again, I wrote this first draft on my own without really talking about it and needed to get it out. But when I shared it with her and with that team they were really encouraging, gave me a round of notes, got that round of notes done over the course of a few months and then decided to pursue finding an agent for this project to give it that boost.
Speaker 2:And I ended up back with the agent that had represented my little first young adult novel. She was at a different firm, she had moved over to CAA Creative Artists and Molly Glick is her name and she's wonderful and she again supported the work and wanted to work with me on it, gave me a big round of notes. That round of notes gave me permission to pursue a little bit of a more modern ending without giving anything away. So that was a big moment for the book Again six months of editing that until we all felt like it was ready to take out to market and then we submitted it and it was a fast and very, very exciting process to sale, ultimately landing with Putnam.
Speaker 1:Molly's name comes up a lot. She is an agent on fire right now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she's wonderful and I could not believe. I've worked with my managers for many years and I had a wonderful experience with Molly the first time, but that book was completed when it arrived to her and it was a different situation. The way that she dug in and continues to dig in because, very fortunately, because of the way that my sale went on the first book, it was a two book deal and the way that she's dug in on this second book both of my reps I think it's really rare and I just I feel very lucky. I think there's a lot of care there and I'll also say one of the things that has helped me is I feel like the goal of the people that are supporting me is to give me the space and time and confidence to do great work, as opposed to pressure me with time and other levers to just get the work done quickly, to just go, go, go. And so they talk a lot about this being a long relationship and working toward that, including the team at Putnam, and I feel like that is rare.
Speaker 1:Well, it's good to know you and your books have a good home. Now, what are you currently reading?
Speaker 2:I was so excited to get to talk about this because I want to reference almost as a point of practice. I really can't read fiction when I'm deep in a rewrite, so before I write I'm reading and consuming everything that may be somewhat similar to what I'm going to be doing, and I read, read, read and then one time it is really hard for me. So I'm actually reading a work of nonfiction right now. It's called Burnout by Emily and Amelia Nagoski. They are sisters and both really interesting individuals.
Speaker 2:Emily has published before in the nonfiction category in different subjects, but it's really about the process that our bodies go through to offload stress, which is very helpful for me at this juncture as I'm moving through getting ready to publish and finishing the second book. But I also, just because I love them, have to point out that the moment my second book is done, I'll be reading the Sicilian Inheritance by Joe Piazza and Expiration Dates by Rebecca Searle. They are, I can see them, they're all on the top of my bookshelf and I haven't. You know, maybe Emma Wood Beach up by you is a good destination. I just long to take a little, maybe an overnight or a couple overnights after this process and get to read my fiction again.
Speaker 1:Jessie, it's been lovely chatting with you and I wish you all the best with your latest novel, the Heirloom.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much and thank you again for having me on.
Speaker 1:You've been listening to my conversation with author Jessie Rosen about her new book, the Heirloom. To help the show reach more people, please share episodes with friends and family and on social media, and remember to subscribe and leave a review wherever you listen to this podcast. To find out more about the Bookshop Podcast, go to thebookshoppodcastcom and make sure to subscribe and leave a review wherever you listen to the show. You can also follow me at MandyJacksonBeverly on X, Instagram and Facebook and on YouTube at the Bookshop Podcast. If you have a favorite indie bookshop that you'd like to suggest we have on the podcast, I'd love to hear from you via the contact form at TheBookshopPodcastcom. The Bookshop Podcast is written and produced by me, Mandy Jackson-Beverly, Theme music provided by Brian Beverly, executive assistant to Mandy, Adrienne Otterhan, and graphic design by Frances Farala. Thanks for listening and I'll see you next time.